Talk:Flow

Jump to: navigation, search

About this board

The Collaboration team has enabled Flow on this talk page (documentation).

Previous feedback is on Talk:Flow Portal/Archive2 (using old Liquid Threads), and on our labs server.

You can leave your message in any language, but answers will be made in English (or your language if we speak it).

By clicking "Add topic", you agree to our Terms of Use and agree to irrevocably release your text under the CC BY-SA 3.0 License and GFDL

My Flow can not work now

3
Summary by Trizek (WMF)

At the moment it is not possible to activate and deactivate Flow on a user talk page. Activate or deactivate Flow will lead to an empty page, with an error message.

Developers are fixing it now.

Pdch226 (talkcontribs)

My Flow ConfirmEditer postion can not work

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

@Trizek (WMF) Has this been fixed yet? I want to disable Flow on my talkpage.

Yankeesjess82 (talkcontribs)

Dear Mediawiki, 2-18-17

Here is the Update that still needs to get done right away On The Web Site at www.en.wikipedia.org On The WTIC-FM Page The Old 96.5 TIC-FM Logo 1 December 2009 needs to get taken off right away thats because its not the same as the website & The New 96.5 TIC-FM Logo thats On The New Web Site at www.965tic.cbslocal.com thats on the top left needs to get put on right away & Would you please keep that in mind & don,t forget to get this fixed right away & don,t forget to take care of it right away thats because it has been years & years already & don,t forget to get this problem fixed right away & don,t forget. Please Write Back to my E-mail address is jesst1982@sbcglobal.net

Reply to "My Flow can not work now"

How much money was wasted on this failed project?

8
The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Has anyone published a guesstimate of the amount of money that was wasted on this terrible idea?

Sänger (talkcontribs)

Look at this thread, they actively deny VE on talk pages, probably to push this failed bullshit Flow. This is just a weask forum impersonation, without any of the flexibilities the current system has. Dumbed down beyond recognition to increase the facebookisation.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

you summed it up nicely here: "preferred to create shiny new bling instead of boring maintenance".

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VanityProject

Flow is a vanity project, just like LT was.

Sänger (talkcontribs)

They did a so-called Flow satisfaction survey, but under completely bogus assumptions: They artificially created a rift between wysiwyg and proper talk pages, although that's just a decision by the WMF not to implement it on talk pages, without real merit. They based a lot of the questions ion this bogus assumption, so the answers are just rubbish. Of course asked this way: old fashioned editor or wysiwyg-editor, and the second only possible with flow, you'll get the answers, that were intended by this: I want wysiwyg, so I have to want Flow.

It's this complete dishonesty about projects like Flow that's so frustrating. They seem to do anything, including blatant lies, to push their pet projects against the community. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 17:28, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

The WMF should not be allowed to use surveys because they are using them to get the result they want instead of trying to determine what the consensus is.

They use surveys on external servers, and they only invite a small group of people, because they know the majority disagrees with them. We should have an RfC on en.wiki instead.

Sänger (talkcontribs)

There was an RfC on enWP already, and Flow was planted in the bin: T148611.

They will probably get the same results on deWP, if they dare to introduce this piece of junk there anywhere.

Bur as you see on this baloney "survey", they don't like real feedback based on facts, they live on those kind of alternative facts like the groper in chief and his lackeys. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 14:43, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

Sänger (talkcontribs)

Thanks, He7d3r, for fixing my wrong syntax. I tried to do this the usual way, via the thanks link in the version history, but thanks to Flow that's impossible. So I had to use this quite elaborate way ;) Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 08:38, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Check out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(proposals)#Proposal_to_submit_blockers_on_replacing_our_wikitext_editor

@Sänger

Reply to "How much money was wasted on this failed project?"

What can interested users do to help the development of Flow (when it starts again)?

45
BurritoBazooka (talkcontribs)

I really like Flow, and dislike the English Wikipedia's current talk page system. I have witnessed a lot of instances where users are confused about the talk page system and end up using it wrong, many times resulting in their opinions not seen by the relevant people, nevermind considered; and other times resulting in historical discussions being difficult to follow without using the page history to see who said what when.

I think Flow is better for new users, and is a good way of encouraging their input on Wikipedia, thus making Wikipedia grow as a project - at the very least by making it easier for them to submit properly filed edit requests. Although I have a personal leaning towards the freeform style that Wikipedia's talk page system allows for, I want to see Flow succeed for the greater good, and I think there are many others like me. I'm glad to see it being implemented in other Wikimedia projects and I hope that it will benefit them greatly.

I recently noticed that the English Wikipedia has had its Flow extension uninstalled because of the halt in development.

What can people like me do to help Flow succeed? Is there a donation page especially for this extension? Could there be one next time development starts? Is there a bounty program? A box to tick showing our support?

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

If you want Flow to succeed you would have to redesign it from scratch.

BurritoBazooka (talkcontribs)

What issue do you have with it? It's far better than the current talk page system, that's why I like it. Redesigning it would mean it would just take longer to implement.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

No, it is inferior to the current talk page system. Flow is confusing, counter-intuitive, user-unfriendly and a gigantic waste of time and money.

Are you aware that people are trying to create a VisualEditor? The VisualEditor will make Flow obsolete, right? Or do you think we should ask newbies to learn to use both Visual Editor and Flow??

BurritoBazooka (talkcontribs)

Flow doesn't require that much learning. VisualEditor will still not be a suitable interface for "comment section" type interaction.

"confusing, counter-intuitive, user-unfriendly"

I disagree that this is a good reason to require a complete redesign. Any concerns can be handled during the next development phase. I really don't think it needs redesigning from the ground up.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Flow is confusing, annoying and very buggy. Why can't I delete my own comments for example? WTF does "hiding" a comment do? Many other people have already expressed their displeasure with it. VisualEditor is currently not ready to be used on talkpages (or anywhere else), but maybe it will be at some point in the future.

I hope there won't be another development phase, because Flow is a huge waste of time that could've been spend more productively.

A complete redesign of Flow could result in a viable alternative to normal talkpages, but at this stage it is probably better to send Flow to /dev/null and forget it ever existed.

I tried to save this message and it gave me this error: http://imgur.com/a/bRT0w

Developing Flow and VE alongside each other is (obviously) a stupid idea. If we would use them both then newbies would be required to learn 2 different badly implemented counter-intuitive systems that are (in their current state) inferior to wikimarkup. We have to make a choice, and Flow is the least desirable option.

You and I may have a high-speed internet connection and a computer worth several thousand euros, but not everyone is so lucky, and Flow is basically unusable for those on older hardware with a bad WIFI connection.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

VE will not be used on talk pages because discussions are not plain text editing. That has been said and repeated.

Sänger (talkcontribs)

Yes, because it's a threat for this new pet project here, not because of some valid reason.

A wikipage is a wikipage is a wikipage. The best thing about this wikisystem is, that in principle all pages are just the same, editable in the same manner, no rift between the pages. There are some gimmicks, that have been developed for certain types of pages, but that's the only difference. The exemption was LQT, which was a failure. Now they want to recreate LQT in another manner, to get some dumbed down forumesque page to simulate some blahblah pages from social media.

This page here has a complete different look and feel as all other pages in the wikiverse, it's only useful for discussions and social chatter, not for working on articles for the wikipedias around the world. A talk page of an article is the core implementation of any talk page, any other implementation hast to cow to the needs of article talk pages. The wikiverse is about the creation of articles, it's talk pages for the betterment of them, to test stuff, to show co-authors solutions for problems on the front side, to answer several former questions at once, to restructure some parts that have run out of control, to divide and unite different threads, all possible with the same tools used on every other page in the whole wikiverse.

But not here, this is just a weak forum implementation, without any other merit. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 15:56, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Do you think repeating a nonsensical mantra over and over is a good strategy to use in communication with people who disagree with you? It seems quite insulting to me. I am not a [[:en:Hare Krishna (mantra)|Hare Krishna]].

If VE will always be restricted to plain text then VE is not gonna be very useful. Seems like a huge waste of time and money to me.

I can't even preview my edits in Flow... I tried to link to an article on en.wiki and it failed (after annoying me with a stupid GUI).

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

There is plenty of pages plain text, actually quite all. But structured data pages, like the ones using Wikibase, are using VE. That's a decision from the VE team. That decision also concerns talk pages.

Concerning the preview, I've seen on you screenshot that you have an interface like that one:

If so, you are using the visual mode. If you type :en:Hare Krishna (mantra) in the link inspector, that will create a link . If you prefer to use wikitext, you can click on the two brackets to have access to wikitext, and then on the pen to have a preview. Add a link using Flow's GUI is the same as on the visual editor for articles.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

That proves my point about how counter-intuitive and badly designed this system is.

When I type the first 2 square brackets a GUI pops up and the square brackets disappear.

This is a bad idea, the brackets shouldn't disappear, ask any UX designer.

Then I type a colon and the box becomes red (which makes me believe something is wrong).

When I type the first letter (the letter "e") the GUI shows me article search results from the wiki I am currently on, even though I already typed a colon.

It is far more likely that I am going to link to a category or another wiki.

The search results disappear again when I have written <nowiki>[[:en:</nowiki> It doesn't give me any search results that are categories or articles on the English Wikipedia.

My father is old, how is he supposed to understand how to use this functionality?

How are people with visual handicaps going to use this GUI?

In the bottom right of the box I am typing this message in there is an icon with 4 square brackets. Of course I assumed that this means (internal) link.

Near the bottom left of the box I am typing in there is a more conventional hyperlink symbol, so I would assume that means external link.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

You are raising up problems that are not Flow specific, but visual editing ones.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

I do not use Visual Editor (for obvious reasons). Does Flow use VE?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Both visual editing and wikitext editing. I've explained it to you just above your previous answer.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Sorry, I forgot, that was 10 days ago. Thank you I will probably have to install VE and Flow on my own mediawiki installation in order to understand how everything works.

Sänger (talkcontribs)

That's difficult. As the fairy tale goes, VE is not suitable for talk pages, at least that's what the fanboys say, it's not VE but the underlying Parsoid Engine that's used here, and by the VE as well. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 18:18, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Hm, interesting. I will have a look at this Parsoid thingy. The name is pretty cool! Oh look I praised something even though I dislike Flow maybe we won't be blocked now.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hello BurritoBazooka

A good way to help talk page improvements is to show how important it is for you. Thank you for your message!

Flow extension has been uninstalled from English Wikipedia after a community discussion. Some other communities are using Flow on user talk pages, as a Beta feature (people can opt-in) or as the default discussion system (like here, on mediawiki.org).

At the moment, Flow development is stalled, waiting for a decision concerning talk pages improvements. That decision will be partially based on the results of a survey I'm working on at the moment. I hope we can reach a firm decision in 2017. There is no donation page dedicated to that project, but, if you are a developer (PHP), you can help for sure.

You can remain informed about the next steps concerning Flow by subscribing to our monthly newsletter (edit: as you already did).

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

The community has already reached a firm decision on Flow's future, the overwhelming consensus on en.wiki is that Flow is shit, but that is difficult to accept for some people who have a minority viewpoint.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

English Wikipedia's consensus is a consensus for just one wiki among hundreds, not the whole community one. Other wikis don't agree with that consensus. Please show respect to those communities.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Woah, maybe the WMF should show some respect to the communities... The WMF is using money earned by content creators to fund stupid vanity projects instead of using it to serve & protect those communities like they are supposed to!

The WMF does not respect the communities and it does not respect the people who have donated to the WMF, that is a major problem.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

We have respected the wish of English Wikipedia to remove Flow. We are also respecting the wish of other communities that want to use Flow to ease discussions.

A lack of respect would be to force communities to use Flow, which is not the case: community volunteer and must have a discussion and a formal decision must be obtained prior enabling Flow on a wiki.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Are there any communities that have requested to use Flow (without it being forced on them)? You are forcing me and Sanger to use Flow, even though we prefer normal talkpages....

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Concerning communities, yes there are. Including mediawikiwiki one.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

No, the MediaWiki community has not requested to use Flow without it being forced on them if I understand the page you linked to correctly.

So the only community where Flow is the default per consensus is gom.wikipedia.org, right?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

MediaWiki has it by default since end of 2013. kab.wp is missing on that list. I have to update that page.

Sänger (talkcontribs)

Where exactly was the community decision to make Flow default here, it has to be some RfC or such, can you please post a link to this? Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 18:24, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

Sänger (talkcontribs)
;P My talk page is a real one, not this fake one here. Yours on the other hand is a Flow forum imitation, you should have started it before this shit was made default by the fanboys. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 17:38, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

How can I disable Flow so I can use my talkpage???

Sänger (talkcontribs)

A lack of respect is not to enable VE on talkpages to push Flow. And don't come with the fairy tales the WMF is uttering, a talk page is a wiki page, and thus able to be edited by VE.

Flow on the other hand creates a deep rift between talk pages and the rest of the wikiverse in terms of look and feel. But it's the new pet project, and much sexier than boring maintenance.

Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 21:03, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

I made a comment here, but it was intended to be a reply to Trizeks comment. Flow does not allow me to remove this comment...

Update: someone hid this comment, which illustrates the problem. Flow simply does not allow me to delete the comment. Hiding it is not the same as deleting it.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

I still do not know how to delete messages. Not just my own, also those of others.

For example, if Sanger doxes himself, and I want to delete the message that contains the dox, how would I go about doing that??

Sänger (talkcontribs)

That's the only way, and go to some oversighter/admin to properly delete that stuff. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 17:44, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

So our overworked admins would have to deal with every single case where text needs to be removed on talkpages if Flow would be the standards for talkpages???

Lol, that is bizarre.

95.33.148.132 (talkcontribs)

I just logged out, to see whether I can see anything, and as an IP I'm not able to see the hidden stuff, so probably webspiders won't as well. Sänger as an IP ~~~~

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Woah that means that Flow has created a totally new type of vandalism, any IP can simply start hiding posts for no reason!

95.33.148.132 (talkcontribs)

Yes, I can! And don't dare to reopen your post!

Sänger (talkcontribs)

Can you undelete your own post now? I can't see it any more. And I can't undelete it as Sänger as well.

I still can see it in the single post view: https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Topic:Tfvdax4qh9t3ijxd&topic_postId=tkahppgqf59h3cle&topic_revId=tkahppgqf59h3cle&action=single-view

It's possible to reopen probably anything in the version history, so this hiding doesn't really serve anything. Next I'll try an unhide as an IP. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 18:05, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

I would if I knew how to do that conveniently! Do I really have to dig through all the edits on the History page to unhide my post?? Are we going to get blocked because we do not like Flow?

This was intended to be a reply to the IP, but I cannot delete it here and move it there.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

@Sänger

I cannot unhide it in single post view...

I cannot unhide it in topic view Topic:Tfvdax4qh9t3ijxd

The topic view shows this line: This comment was hidden by Sänger (history)

The history link goes to the history page, there is no unhide link.

Sänger (talkcontribs)

There is an (hide|unhide) link at the end of every version, at least in my history view. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 18:10, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Yeah, there are (hide|unhide) links on the history page, but not on the talkpage itself.

Imagine if someone has hidden a post on a popular topic on a frequently used talkpage that was was written in a long time ago...

The history link goes to the history of the topic, but not to the specific edit.

I wonder how archiving would work when posts can be hidden. Flow is so confusing!

I don't seem to be able to move my post to a new location for some reason.

Sänger (talkcontribs)

Archiving? Oh, my dear, how last year you are...

There is no archiving in Flow, it's a never ending page, to scroll endlessly down. I've been told that facebook uses this so they had to imitate it. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 18:26, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

I feel old now. Facebook is evil, like Google.

This is weird, on Special:SpecialPages I found a link that says "Enable Flow" so I tried visiting Special:DisableFlow but it does not exist....

Sänger (talkcontribs)

I tend to agree with your views about the Datenkraken (data leech, literally data kraken) Fratzenbuch and Kugel (literally grimace book and globe), and I have neither a facebook account nor an active google one (I've only got one, because I use an android phone) Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 18:42, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

Reply to "What can interested users do to help the development of Flow (when it starts again)?"
A2093064 (talkcontribs)

I use "$wgNamespaceContentModels[NS_USER_TALK] = CONTENT_MODEL_FLOW_BOARD;" to enable Flow in User_talk namespace. But now I want to disable it (Keep using Flow in other namespaces).

When I remove the above code, I got {"flow-workflow":"t8kftrqtinnh54af"} in those page in User_talk. And I can't use Special:EnableFlow to enable Flow on it.

Edward Chernenko (talkcontribs)

You can probably use Special:ChangeContentModel on those pages, thus marking them as "flow boards" manually. Edward Chernenko (talk) 18:25, 3 January 2017 (UTC)

Mattflaschen-WMF (talkcontribs)

Make sure you have $wgContentHandlerUseDB set to true (it is true by default).

Then, set User talk back to Flow, and follow the steps at Extension:Flow#Enabling or disabling Flow. In your case, you just need the =3 set of commands. I just added those docs (sorry, it wasn't properly documented before).

Basically, this sets the correct values for existing pages and revisions, so it is safe to change the defaults.

Let me know how that goes.

A2093064 (talkcontribs)

It works. Thank you for your help.

Reply to "How to disable Flow in User_talk"
The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Please remove it, it is almost as bad as LT!

Jdforrester (WMF) (talkcontribs)

No.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

But you are aware that it is a failed experiment, right?

Jdforrester (WMF) (talkcontribs)

If you continue to be disruptive on this wiki, you might well get blocked. Please engage usefully or not at all.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Well, I have explained why Flow is a bad idea, I have mentioned some of Flow's downsides, and I explained how it can be improved. I have not been disruptive.

If we add indenting functionality to VE then we can use it on talkpages.

The Quixotic Potato (talkcontribs)

Does Sanger also need to worry about getting blocked? He also writes stuff you disagree with... @ Sänger

Sänger (talkcontribs)

I'm already blocked from Phabricator for my insistence on a meaningful answer by the devs ;)

My block log here is up to now clean, though I'm quite outspoken as well. Grüße vom Sänger ♫(Reden) 17:54, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

Reply to "Remove Flow from mediawiki.org"
Murbaut (talkcontribs)

Do you know how to add "Start a new topic" button. In mycss see I use flow id flow

Vriullop (talkcontribs)

Use link https://id.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Warung_Kopi_(Bantuan)&action=new-topic

Murbaut (talkcontribs)

Thanks :) I like it

Murbaut (talkcontribs)

@Vriullop: And but how to mark topic "Done"?

Murbaut (talkcontribs)

how to flow-lock?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

You want to create a button to mark a topic as done ("resolved")?

Murbaut (talkcontribs)

yes

Murbaut (talkcontribs)

@Trizek (WMF): How?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

To do so, you have to catch the PAGENAME, and then use lock-topic and flow_moderationState=lock actions :

https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Topic:{{PAGENAME}}&action=lock-topic&flow_moderationState=lock

Result : https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Topic:Tj0zhfjbjavvsq9j&action=lock-topic&flow_moderationState=lock

That option is also available in the Topic's ... menu.

Murbaut (talkcontribs)

Thanks You. You is very help @Trizek (WMF):

Reply to "Problem with flow mycss"
Sunpriat (talkcontribs)

- posts are "in the box" (a nickname, menu, answer, date)

- this adds parasitic text to the flow - conversation flow is interrupted disturbing "answer*thank" - it reads, it interferes

- left part of the flow is obtained overloaded text "nick-message-answer*thank...again"

- sequence "line-answer-line-nick-line" visually takes unforgivable plenty of space in the debate, eats space adding ragged white void "in the center" between "answer-date nick-menu"

- words answer*thanks constantly falls in the "read the post" - when you read posts in a row on the board is obtained as the radio traffic "A-bbbbb-c-d, A-bbbb-c-d..."(nick-message-answer*thank). This "thank" can be safely moved to the menu, or replace per symbol that is not read mentally

- bold nick dominates the text. Message is important and not the one who wrote it. If this is done in order to improve the vision of people with low vision, then again, it is more important than the appearance of the text and not the author.

This is variant image

div > .flow-post-meta { position: absolute; top: 0em; float: right; right: 3em;} .flow-post-timestamp {float: left;} .flow-post-meta-actions {float: none;} div > .flow-post-content {margin-top: -0.5em;}

- the bottom line is raised up to the menu, and the discussion has become "easier" to read from top to bottom on the left


another variant - button "compact view". which would move messages closer to each other, and additional text is shown only when you hover over the message.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Thank you for these suggestions. Your feedback is shared by other users, that have suggested changes like yours. We need to have a look at it.

At the moment, no further improvements will be made until a clear roadmap has been defined. That will happen in a few months from now. More information about that will be posted on the new Collaboration team products newsletter.

Sunpriat (talkcontribs)

I saw an old discussion. And they are very similar to "flow". Maybe the comparison with the old and as we read/write today will help improve the "flow".

Reply to "Heavy view"
Daylen (talkcontribs)

Trizek (WMF) What will talk page templates such as talk header and WikiProject banners look like in flow?

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Same as they do now, only on the side of the page. See w:fr:Wikipédia:Forum des nouveaux/Flow for an example. All the things that would normally be at the top of the page (and you have to scroll past them to see any comments) are in a dedicated space on the side of the page.

Daylen (talkcontribs)

@Whatamidoing (WMF) Would templates such as this and this be redesigned for the new layout? Also, what would the side panel look like on a mobile device?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

In theory, templates are designed to be adaptable to any screen size. If not (fixed width, strictly sized elements), that's already an issue for the current talk pages. :)

In a perfect world, WikiProject templates that are posted on talk pages should be moved to another tab, to have only discussions on the talk page.

You can see the view of any Flow board on mobile by switching to the mobile view, like this: https://fr.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikip%C3%A9dia:Forum_des_nouveaux/Flow If the screen is really narrow, the description goes on top of the page.

Reply to "Talk page templates"
Sänger (talkcontribs)

Please fill out this survey, which is administered by a third-party service. It will not require an email or your username. See our privacy statement

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Distribution of an invitation for Mediawikiwiki users will be done today or at the beginning of next week. It has been postponed due to difficulties to identify active users on that wiki.

ImperfectlyInformed (talkcontribs)

I wasn't really a fan of this survey. I ended up filling out N/A for almost everything. I don't think it's fair to say Flow is better or worse than the alternative right now per se, because it does have weaknesses and strengths. I don't want to mislead the Product team into thinking that Flow is perfect, but I also don't want to discourage them. Flow is necessary, and lots of good progress has been made. Admittedly, I haven't really played with Flow much.

Not necessarily comprehensive list of specifics:

  • I do feel like it is not as good as Reddit, which most internet denizens are familiar with. For example, I would like to be able to vote on comments and collapse threads.
  • Outdenting and adding section headings is unclear, and doesn't roll up into a table of contents, as SMcCandlish has noted below (altho I have trouble finding real specific improvement suggestions from the discussion below).
  • "Hide" is weird - not really clear if that hides it for everyone or just me, but I think it hides for everyone? Maybe it should be report or something. Most users (including someone like, who has been editing since 2007) don't feel comfortable just hiding someone's comments.
  • More whitespace and larger font than I'd like. I guess that's probably configurable, but again, think about the audience... Wikipedia discussions are often HUGE, so extra whitespace can get annoying quick.
Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Thank you for your feedback, ImperfectlyInformed!

Flow is not perfect, we know that, and there is a lot of things to improve on it. We expect to have enough community feedback to create a strategy for the future.

I've read some random comments and results, and Flow users mostly have the same opinion as yours: Flow is good, but not that much. It must be improved because there is a lot of features missing. I've also read some comments like yours, suggesting that kind of improvements. I hope we will adress these concerns soon.

Reply to "A survey has started about Flow"

Error when moving from flow back to liquidthreads.

3
50.254.138.165 (talkcontribs)

Hello,

Due to some minor issues with flow that I won't go into, I have decided to go back to LIquidthreads temporarily. I removed the "require_once "$IP/extensions/Flow/Flow.php";" statement for flow from LocalSettings.php, and re-added the require once statement for liquidthreads. Everything is working great except on the talk pages I had created when I was using Flow. To clarify, talk pages that were not created when flow was enabled work fine, only the ones that were created using flow. When I try to access the talk pages that previously had flow pages created on them I get the error:

/index.php/Talk:Organization MWUnknownContentModelException from line 353 of /var/www/html/includes/content/ContentHandler.php: The content model 'flow-board' is not registered on this wiki.

See https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Content_handlers to find out which extensions handle this content model.

Backtrace:

#0 /var/www/html/includes/content/ContentHandler.php(290): ContentHandler::getForModelID(string)

#1 /var/www/html/includes/MediaWiki.php(405): ContentHandler::getForTitle(Title)

#2 /var/www/html/includes/MediaWiki.php(286): MediaWiki->initializeArticle()

#3 /var/www/html/includes/MediaWiki.php(745): MediaWiki->performRequest()

#4 /var/www/html/includes/MediaWiki.php(519): MediaWiki->main()

#5 /var/www/html/index.php(43): MediaWiki->run()

#6 {main}

I know this has something to do with ContentHandler.php and switching the content model away from flow board, but I am unsure how to do this.

Thanks and any help is greatly appreciated.

Mattflaschen-WMF (talkcontribs)

"I removed the "require_once "$IP/extensions/Flow/Flow.php";" statement for flow"

By doing so, you uninstalled Flow. That is why Flow boards no longer work. I don't recommend uninstalling Flow. I think it will cause issues such as broken logs. (You can add that line back to re-enable it.)

If you want to stop using it, you can just move the Flow boards to archive pages (there is a moveBatch.php in core that may be helpful).

If you really want to uninstall Flow, you can first use maintenance/convertToText.php (in the Flow extension) to convert the pages to text, then delete the original Flow versions.

50.254.138.165 (talkcontribs)

Thank you.

Reply to "Error when moving from flow back to liquidthreads."