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Editing content of custom tags in VisualEditor?

1 (talkcontribs)


are there any resources on how to make the content/value of custom tags created via tag extension (Manual:Tag extensions) edit-able inside VisualEditor?

Reply to "Editing content of custom tags in VisualEditor?"
Quiddity (WMF) (talkcontribs)

@Juandev Hi, you asked a question in IRC -tech, and then went offline whilst I was researching and typing a reply! I'll re-paste here, and give a partial answer. Possibly someone else can correct or confirm...

<Juandev>  is there a way VE does not insert property and = of a template? just insert variable?
<Juandev>  maybe it could be influenced by td?
<Juandev>  example:
<Juandev>  instead of "Kategorie = Bažantnice (nature reserve)" we need just  "Bažantnice (nature reserve)" to be inserted
<Juandev>  now I am not sure if that is a problem of a template itself that it dont work properly with VE or we can fix it via TD?

First, why do you not want to insert the name of the parameter, in some cases?

I would guess: You want to reduce the quantity of wikitext in general, and also to make diffs even smaller. But possibly there are other reasons?

Partial answer (Note: the documentation about "anonymous/numbered/named-parameters" is at Help:Templates):

  1. I don't think this is possible.
  2. Using anonymous-parameters, instead of named-parameters, means that if an optional value is missing, we have to include the double-pipe "||". This is confusing to look at, and can more easily lead to breakages.
  3. Using anonymous-parameters, also requires that all the values must appear in an exact order.
  4. The named parameters can help newcomers to instantly understand what the wikitext means, instead of having to deduce it.

So, I would suggest that keeping the parameters' names, is generally more helpful to the wide-variety of people who might look at the wikitext, than removing them would be. Hope that helps.

Reply to "Excluding the named parameters"

VE not loading pages with a thumbnail in it

Blazyb (talkcontribs)

Whenever I try to enter VE edit mode in a page that got a thumbnail in it I get this error:

Elitre (WMF) (talkcontribs)

It'd be quite useful if you linked to an example of such a page (assuming you're talking about a WMF wiki), and provided details such as web browser, computer operating system, and wiki skin (usually Vector, sometimes Monobook).

Blazyb (talkcontribs)

The wiki is a private corporate one so I can't link it. However I tried to replicate the same problem on my own private wiki and it seemed to work with thumbnails there..

Mediawiki 1.25.1

PHP 5.4.16

MySQL 5.5.32

Apache 2.4.4

Windows 2008 R2

Vector skin

Problem in both IE10 and Chrome.

Blazyb (talkcontribs)

The page consists only of a thumbnailed image and VE won't load.

[[File:test.png |thumb|test]]

edit: Not only thumbnailed images will cause this issue. right and centered images causes it too, while "ordinary" images work.

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Is that image present on the local wiki, or are you using InstantCommons (or something similar)?

Blazyb (talkcontribs)

Yes it is present on the local wiki

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

That's strange. Are you have other problems with images in general, like this report?

Jdforrester (WMF) (talkcontribs)

My first thought is that you have an incompatible version of VisualEditor and MediaWiki, which is only apparent when the code used about images is loaded…

Reply to "VE not loading pages with a thumbnail in it"
ManosHacker (talkcontribs)

In many cases we cannot tell the first from the last name of an author, especially in different localization.

In many cases we have more than one author and Author field is very handy for completion of all authors.

Last name and first name entries sometimes make contributor's life hard and push back to wikimarkup copy-paste solution for filling in citations of missing fields.

Flexibility should be provided.

  1. checkbox for the contrinutor to declare if he/she knows, for the author, which part of the name is first and which is last, and suggestion, if possible, or switching to author field to fill in
  2. select the number of authors to fetch the needed fields to fill in
Elitre (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Can you please specify which template you are talking about? Thanks.

ManosHacker (talkcontribs)

All templates. Author field is not there for any of them (web, book, news and journal).

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Which Wikipedia (or other wiki) are you talking about?

ManosHacker (talkcontribs)

Greek Wikipedia and English Wikipedia do not have the "Author" parameter to fill it in, in VE citations. Instead there is only First name and Last name to fill in. Author parameter cannot be called from inside VE, or at least I cannot find it.

In case we cannot tell first from last name, author should be used instead of first and last.

In case of many authors (i.e. cite journal), selecting the number of authors should automatically go and fetch first2/last2, first3/last3, first4/last4 to fill them in and not go fetch them one by one by hand, or provide to fill in just the "Author" filed for all authors.

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Most of the citation templates were re-written at en.wp a couple of years ago. One result is that |last= and |author= (and several other things: last1, surname, surname1, author1) are the same thing. If the Greek Wikipedia has copied the Lua modules from en.wp, then it's the same thing there.

The request for automatically selecting first and last fields is T52407. I believe that it's stalled on design issues.

ManosHacker (talkcontribs)

I could instruct my students to always use the last= fileld in case they cannot tell first from last name, and move to visual editor.

If pre-fetching hidden fields to be filled in, by selecting number of authors, to save extra mouse clicks, sounds like a good idea, please implement it. It is especially useful in cite journal.

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

My favorite way to deal with {{Cite journal}} is to paste in a PubMed URL and let the citoid service fill it out for me. ;-)

I've filed the idea of selecting the number of authors as phab:T119423 . Feel free to "Edit Task" to explain it better.

Reply to "Author(-s) in citation" (talkcontribs)
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 9_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/601.1.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/9.0 Mobile/13B143 Safari/601.1


Elitre (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Greetings! This is meant as a thread for editors from a specific set of Wikipedias. Thanks for sharing your feedback about VisualEditor with us: we're working to improve editing experience for all users at your wiki.

Reply to "Feedback from Phase 6 Wikipedias"
Ftiercel (talkcontribs)


A mysterious bullet appears on edit mode in the "Liens externes" section:

Jdforrester (WMF) (talkcontribs)

It looks like the template "Autorité" is outputting an extra <li>; if you fix the template, it will go away.

Reply to "Mysterious bullet"
Mannu11 (talkcontribs) making my first yellow page..mediawiki will display soon

Reply to "my first yellow page"
ManosHacker (talkcontribs)

We should be able to add notes the same way we add citations, by single click button. Ref grouping is for computer geeks and notes group naming is up to the editor.

A magnet for notes ("Notes list" in addition to "References list" placement) should also be created.

Elitre (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Again, can you please link to the template you have in mind? Thanks. (talkcontribs)

We can add a note using <ref></ref> but then the note apeears inside citations list.

A lot of people use <ref group="note"></ref> in order to make notes appear separately from citations, in their own list.

A note differs from a citation. A note explains, a citation documents.

If we want to have nice notes in articles we now have to use grouping in citations, inside VE, and one editor groups as "note", some other might group by "not.", "n", "n." etch. VE contributors have to do funny stuff with grouping. It should be only a few clicks away and the same for all.

It might also be nice to autonumber notes with letters instead of numbers, just to make a difference from citations and make the article more attractive.

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

I'm not sure what you mean by "funny stuff with grouping". It sounds like you want this. Obviously, that can be done in VisualEditor (because I just did it! ;-) It took me three clicks to make that note, which probably counts as "only a few clicks away", and another three clicks to insert and label the references list at the end.

The problem with different people choosing different group names is a serious fault of wikitext. In the wikitext editor, it can be hard to see what group names previous people have used. However, in VisualEditor, this problem is reduced. VisualEditor shows you the list of existing groups, and if one already exists (regardless of whether it has been named "note", "not.", "n", or something else), then you merely select the existing name from the list.

ManosHacker (talkcontribs)

I am teaching new wikipedians in 2 hours sessions, 4 times a week, since may 2014, I have been teaching for a whole year once a month during 2012 and done, apart from these, the most presentations and workshops of Wikipedia in Greece, since 2011. The goal of Wikipedia School is to bring simple people (not computer geeks) to Wikipedia and I think that goes for Visual Editor, too. Ref grouping is chineese. Notes should be notes as citations should be citations.

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Refs and notes are the same thing in wikitext, and the only difference is the group name that you give it. I cannot think of a method that both:

  1. automatically gives a group name of "notes" (or whatever) if you click on a button (which would make notes be a one-click action), and
  2. is compatible with the existing articles (which use a wide variety of other group names for explanatory footnotes).

Can you?

ManosHacker (talkcontribs)

1. Adding a note with a single click in VE does not require new wikimarkup, only argreed grouping for notes from now on

2. In case we care for, past edited, custom ref grouping,

a. If by editing in VE we reach single custom ref grouping, VE should automatically turn it to note grouping, after recognition or verification.

b. If more than one ref groups appear, we could be prompted to select which one is the note group, if it is not automatically recognized.

Reply to "Notes"

Toggle edit mode

Summary by Jdforrester (WMF)

It's being worked on. :-)

Igel B TyMaHe (talkcontribs)

I'm using visual editor for a while and really need only one thing to stay with it indefinetely. This feature is usually implemented in any CMS: toggling between visual and source mode. I just found Switch to Source button and half happy now. Is there any way to switch from source mode back to visual on the fly to make me completely happy?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hi Igel B TyMaHe!

This feature is planned, with a high priority. :)

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

This has been implemented. Look for a black-and-white pencil in the upper-right corner of the wikitext toolbar to see how to move from the wikitext editor to the visual editor.

Reply to "Toggle edit mode"