Talk:Growth/Mentor dashboard

About this board

NGC 54 (talkcontribs)

The default number of shown mentees is 10. Even if I set it to 25, the next time when I visit the Mentor Dashboard it turns again into 10.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)
Martin Urbanec (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hello @NGC 54, I would like to let you know that we fixed the issue you identified here. Can you try it again and let us know if it works? Best,

NGC 54 (talkcontribs)

User Menu translation for Mentor dashboard

4
Ponor (talkcontribs)
Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)
Ponor (talkcontribs)
Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

This is strange as it is listed when I search for it in the list.

Reply to "User Menu translation for Mentor dashboard"
Sunpriat (talkcontribs)

Translatewiki.net says "user saved an edit" "latest edit" in https://translatewiki.net/wiki/MediaWiki:Growthexperiments-mentor-dashboard-mentee-overview-active-ago/qqq https://translatewiki.net/wiki/MediaWiki:Growthexperiments-homepage-mentorship-mentor-active-today/qqq . But in fact, "active today" is shown even if the user has not saved edits. (e.g. a new user, registered a few days ago and has 0 edits, but he is "active today") Can you update the documentation to more fully reflect why the user may still be considered "active"?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

We consider a user as being active if they make a logged action, and creating an account is one of them.

We are thinking about removing users with zero edits from this list. What do you think?

Sunpriat (talkcontribs)

@Trizek (WMF) So the text of the documentation needs this explanation. This behavior is not described either in the translatewiki or mediawiki (Growth/Mentor dashboard#M1: Your mentees - an overview of the mentees activity).

The problem is not with this zero edits group of users (they are just more understandable as an example). This affects any users. The problem is the fact of activity, activity = edit (according to existing documentation), activity is visually shown but any edits are not visible from the contribution (also, when you see that the numbers next to the nickname in the columns in the displayed table have not changed), it is logical that you start looking for what the user did wrong, that his edits were deleted and not visible. The user of the panels wants to have the right expectations for how the activity indicator works. If there is no additional privacy issue in the activity data, then removing zero edits group will not do anything useful.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Starting next week, mentors will see newcomers assigned to them who have made at least one edit, up to 200 edits. Mentors will be able to change these values using the filters on their dashboard. Also, the last choice of filters will now be saved. Would it help?

Sunpriat (talkcontribs)

@Trizek (WMF) My question was about those two /qqq on Translatewiki.net. Can we change "mentor's latest edit is today" & "last time user saved an edit" in the "external source" ("Importing a new version from external source" ) to "mentor's latest edit (or another logged action) is today" & "last time user saved an edit (or another logged action)"?

Reply to ""active""
Ainali (talkcontribs)
MMiller (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hi @Ainali -- thanks for paying close attention to the newsletter and being interested in the dashboard. @Trizek (WMF) and @Martin Urbanec (WMF) are working on the dashboard and can fill you in on the specifics of the rollout. I hope that once it's enabled on svwiki, you can come back here and tell us what you think!

Martin Urbanec (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hello @Ainali, thanks for bringing this up. The release date for mentor dashboard is December 07 (today); unfortunately, that's few hours after the tech news were distributed.

Anyway, mentor dashboard should now indeed be available at sv.wikipedia (and all the other wikis). Please feel free to try it out and let us know what you think about it!

Ainali (talkcontribs)

Yes, it's there now! Will take a look!

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Cool. Let is know about your feedback! :)

Ainali (talkcontribs)

Hmm.. I think the table is buggy, or the definition of who should show up in it is not correct. For example, I don't see User:Musabjosef in the table, but {{#mentor:Musabjosef}} shows my name and the user has edits in the last two months.

Martin Urbanec (WMF) (talkcontribs)

@Ainali Are you sure they don't show up in the table? I checked the database, and they're supposed to show there. Note the table has multiple pages -- they might not be on the first one. You can use the filtering to look them up.

Ainali (talkcontribs)

Oh, they are there. I misunderstood the number for the pages and thought that was the total number of users, so when it said shows 1 of 17 I didn't care to click more than once. Sorry!

Martin Urbanec (WMF) (talkcontribs)

No problem at all! I'm glad you were able to find them. Let us know if you have any other questions.

Reply to "Enabled or not?"
Tol (talkcontribs)

Hello! I recently noticed the addition of a link to this in the upper right links (I don't know the name for them). It takes up too much space; how do I remove it? Thanks.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hello

I guess you refer to the "Mentor dashboard" link we recently added to the personal toolbar for mentors at English Wikipedia?

The best option is to add the following code to your personal CSS: #pt-mentordashboard {display:none;}

Hope this helps!

Tol (talkcontribs)
Reply to "Link in upper-right links"
NGC 54 (talkcontribs)

I would like to test this feature. When will be possible?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

We are still in the early stages. The development has not started, the current work is on designing the interface.

Please add the project page to your watchlist so that you can get updates about the next steps!

NGC 54 (talkcontribs)

What does the name of the special page will be?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

For now we are on Special:MentorDashboard, since it is the term we commonly use.

It will be possible to translate this name in your language when the time comes.

NGC 54 (talkcontribs)
Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

I'm glad to see you being enthusiastic about this tool! We haven't yet started the development of the tool. :)

The different tasks have been created, based on the identification of mentors needs and the design phase.

You can check the last updates on Phabricator (T239234 is the parent task for this project), or on Growth/Growth team updates

NGC 54 (talkcontribs)
Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Quoting the next newsletter that will be posted this Monday:

"Add a link" is now being tested in production and is nearing release on our four pilot wikis (Arabic, Czech, Vietnamese, and Bengali Wikipedias). We'll be doing final tests this week and next week, and then plan to deploy to the four wikis either during May 24 week, or May 31 week. After two weeks, we will analyze the initial data to identify any problems or trends. We expect that this feature will engage new kinds of newcomers in easy and successful edits. If things are going well after four weeks, we'll progressively deploy it to the wikis with Growth features.

NGC 54 (talkcontribs)
Martin Urbanec (WMF) (talkcontribs)

@NGC 54 Hello, I just came over your message here. My name is Martin Urbanec, and I'm working on getting mentor dashboard alive. It can now be tested at English Wikipedia beta wiki. Please let me know what you think about it, I'd be very interested to hear from you.

Reply to "Testing"

Saving response as a template

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Nux (talkcontribs)

I had a lot of repeating questions too. Sometimes I go back to previous newcomer page and just copy part or whole answer to question. This is not ideal (I have to find the question and then find the answer).

Would be more convenient to save a sort of template/FAQ. So when I answer to someone on a talk page it would be nice to have a sort of personal FAQ. And a button below like "Save current to my FAQ". The list could be used to maybe append text to textbox. I could also see it as an accordion with textboxes (from which I could copy parts of text from previous answers)... Something along that lines.

Ailbeve (talkcontribs)
OTichonova (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hello @Nux thank you for sharing your ideas. The FAQ template has come up in conversations with other mentors and I like your idea of a personal FAQ.

We are in the early stages of designing the dashboard so new ideas/suggestions are very welcome.  

Iniquity (talkcontribs)

Yes, as @Ailbeve said above, we have implemented such a mechanism for ruwiki. We use ru:Проект:Помощь_начинающим/FAQ/Ответы.json for ru:Участник:Iluvatar/quickAnswers.js script.

But we can really expand on the idea:

  1. We create a common database of answers to newcomers from mentors
  2. Each mentor, through some module, can add his own answer to the question from the database
  3. When answering a novice editor, the mentor can choose from several answer options that have already been added to the database
  4. Answers in the database can be ranked by rating/popularity or smth else
  5. About the mentor motivation module: with such a system, the mentor can be given badges for the most popular answers among other mentors
Reply to "Saving response as a template"
ValeJappo (talkcontribs)

Hi,

I find this project very interesting.

I think that:

  • Awarding mentors for the job they do is useless: a mentor should be an experienced user, which does not need that. The best award I can receive, is receiving a message from a mentee thanking me (and please, do not add a feature to thank the mentor, the thanks should be spontaneous).
  • In my mentees list, and all features that shows you something about your mentees, I want to see just users that maked me almost a question, or users I manually set as my mentees.
  • I would like to have a watchlist, or a recent changes page, with the edits of the mentees described above.
  • When I take a pause from wiki, I need to be able to temporarily set all my mentees mentor as someone else, it will be great if I can send a message to all of them (mentees), if they do not see "your mentor" but "your mentor' s substitute") or something else, and continuing seeing them as my mentees, so I can still follow their activities.
  • I would like to be able to display a message when certain mentees do certain actions, something like abuse filter, but that only displays a message.
  • I should be able to change "my mentor" tab of a mentee in something like "you don't need a mentor anymore", and stop seeing the user in my mentees list.
  • I would like to have a way to reply with custom standardized messages, helping me in answering common questions
  • I would like to recivie a notification when someone ping my mentee; i should be able to disable this feature for all or just certain mentees.
  • Instead of awards for mentors, i'd like to give standard or custom awards to my mentees.
  • (not for mentors dashboard) in help panel, mentees should see "ask to your mentor" too.
MMiller (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Thank you for these good ideas, @ValeJappo. I have a couple questions:

  • Could you clarify what you mean by, "I want to see just users that maked me almost a question"?
  • You said: "I would like to be able to display a message when certain mentees do certain actions, something like abuse filter, but that only displays a message." What's an example of this kind of situation?

Regarding this idea: "in help panel, mentees should see "ask to your mentor" too", this is actually something we are working on right now! We are going to attempt it first in Czech Wikipedia to see what the impact is on mentors. Here is the Phabricator task about it.

ValeJappo (talkcontribs)

@MMiller (WMF) by "I want to see just users that maked me almost a question", I mean that in an hypothetical mentees list, and in all features that shows me something about my mentees, I would like to see just mentees that asked me almost a question, not mentees that did never asked me a question.

By "I would like to be able to display a message when certain mentees do certain actions, something like abuse filter, but that only displays a message.", I mean something like what happen on itwiki when I add a link to wikipedia.org: when I click "publish", the edit is not saved, but on the top of the page appears the message "You are adding a link to wikipedia.org [...]". If I press another time "publish", the edit is saved. However, this can be difficult and too useless, so maybe just a central notice or an edit notice for some pages, and of course only for some mentees, can be ok. Actually, this idea seems still useless, so I think you can ignore it.

Reply to "My opinion"
Czar (talkcontribs)

I read this project is geared more towards mid-sized Wikipedias but wanted to share a thought from an ENWP editor, if useful

What's most exciting to me about a dashboard is less the dedicated space for managing these interactions but the potential to build it into the existing interface. Like most compelling for me is:

  • I mainly want to see my specified editor/mentee's edits, particularly if highlighted in my regular watchlist in context of other things I'm watching (i.e., not having to check another surface)
    • I particularly want to see high impact edits from my mentees so I can (1) encourage and (2) offer process improvements (i.e., using X template might help)
  • I want to receive a system-wide notification (in the top bar) if my mentee needs help with something and doesn't know how to use the {{ping}} template
  • I do not need to see or maintain a list of dedicated mentees or track them like a leaderboard, except to remove them from my notifications/watchlist (such a list would be depressing as I'd wager most editors won't come back beyond asking one or two questions)
  • I do not need awards—seeing the mentee create content and make impact is the loop and the reward
  • Somewhat out of scope, but as a mentor, I want WMF data to recommend my most valuable actions as a mentor: "Newcomers who receive X from an experienced user have the highest likelihood of returning"—tell me (either by notification or talk page message or email or whatever) what message to send and to whom and you need not build an interface to facilitate it

Hope that can be useful. If/when this extends to larger Wikipedias, I see most of the benefit coming from small tweaks to the existing interface that integrate into my regular editing

MMiller (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hi @Czar -- thank you for leaving these notes here (and in the link you included to the other conversation), and I apologize for my belated reply. This is really valuable stuff -- I think the most important insight is about seeing new information in the same feeds that you already check, instead of having to go to a new interface. That's a perennial design challenge that has come up for features in the past -- it's why, for instance, we have our existing mentorship model send questions to the mentor's talk page instead of asking them to check some new place for the questions. Thanks for the reminder for the case of this dashboard.

For what it's worth, we have heard from mentors in multiple communities about the need for a way to "see who my mentees are". I think your ideas for how this can be lightweight might help us get to something good sooner, once we start work on it. We'll revisit these notes then.

Reply to "Hi"

Thoughts from your community?

3
MMiller (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hi @Ата -- I'm glad you noticed this page. How is mentorship going so far on your wiki? Would this mentor dashboard be useful for you? What would you want it to include?

Ата (talkcontribs)

To my mind, mentorship is going quite well in ukwiki. I posted a question about mentor dashboard on a talk page, and there is only one answer so far which basically lists the features already described here. From my previous interactions with mentors I've seen interest in phab:T227876. There also was an idea of matching newbies to mentors by interest or region instead of creating pairs randomly (though that's probably not related to this dashboard).

MMiller (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Thank you, @Ата. It's good to have these notes here for when we work on this one day.

Reply to "Thoughts from your community?"
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