Talk:Growth

About this board

Discussion related to the old Growth team is archived at Talk:Growth/Growth 2014.

Juandev (talkcontribs)

Is there a video about what the newbie see? Recently I figured out that newbies ask questions on something we dont know how it looks like. I.e. newbies receive dialogs we dont know about.

Martin Urbanec (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Ahoj @Juandev! Děkujeme za zájem o funkce týmu Growth i Tvou otázku. Ano, nějaká videa existují. Na české Wikipedii jsem například před nějakou dobou vyvěsil videa ukazující, jak registrace funguje dnes a jak fungovala dříve. Díky tomu je možné změnu v uživatelském zážitku snadno a rychle porovnat. Jsou sice, pravda, trošku staršího data, ale myslím, že pro ukázku jsou vcelku dostačující (ale stejně je zkusím v nejbližší době aktualizovat).

Je také možné vyzkoušet si funkce týmu Growth vlastnoručně. Buď registrací nového uživatelského účtu (čímž získáš přehled o tom, jak cesta nováčka probíhá od A do Z), anebo zaškrtnutím možností „Zobrazit Domovskou stránku nováčka“, „Odkaz na uživatelské jméno vede na Domovskou stránku nováčka“ a „Povolit panel Potřebuji pomoc“ ve svém nastavení. První dvě zaškrtávací políčka jsou na kartě Údaje o uživateli, to poslední na kartě Editace. Podrobnější instrukce najdeš na Help:Growth/Tools/Enable_the_Homepage/cs.

Kdyby tě o funkcích týmu Growth zajímalo cokoli více, dej vědět – rád otázky zodpovím.

S přáním hezkého zbytku dne,

Reply to "What the newbie see"

Can someone answer my question about A/B test?

1
Lens0021 (talkcontribs)
ChhTJ096 (talkcontribs)

我是中文維基的導師,但現在有事長期不能指導,可否麻煩將我的學員重新分配?

Sunpriat (talkcontribs)

If I want to use suggestions and analytical data from the homepage, is there a way to opt out of the mentor function? Mentors can take participants who did not have a mentor before and intercept a participant by rewriting to themselves. (for example, you can take any account and start stalking it just because of the technical possibility https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%92%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%BF%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%B8%D1%8F:%D0%A4%D0%BE%D1%80%D1%83%D0%BC/%D0%92%D0%BE%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%8B#GrowthExperiments_%D0%B8_%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%BC%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%81%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%82%D0%BE%D1%80%D1%8B-%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%BF%D0%B5%D1%87%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B5 ) The participant can't do anything about it. The mentor can observe the contribution statistics and activity time for an unprecedented long time (even logged actions that are usually not observed by others) that the extension makes to him. Or let's make a trusted WMF account, to which the participants of each wiki could switch when you don't need your statistics to be collected for another and you don't need a chat.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Remove banned accounts from the mentor panel

2
DarwIn (talkcontribs)

Is it possible to remove or (permanently) hide banned accounts from the mentor panel, since they are absolutely useless there and only add to the clutter?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hello Darwin

In theory, in Special:MentorDashboard, indefinitely blocked users shouldn't be visible. Which account do you see there so that we can investigate a possible bug?

Thank you!

Reply to "Remove banned accounts from the mentor panel"

Encourage mentors to check mentees contribution + More Feedback

5
Jcubic (talkcontribs)

This is my opinion about the Growth feature, I've just checked contribution of the last user that asked a question. I've seen that he has some newcomers tasks done, (added wiki links to some pages). And I've seen that often metees ask how long it will take for their edit to be approved (on Polish Wikipedia edits need to be approved to be visible).

The problem I see is that there are not much connection between mentor and mentees. When I sign up for being a mentor (in Polish Wikipedia) they said that I will answer questions maybe once or twice a week. There is MentorDashboard but I don't think that is really useful. I don't check it that often.

But if there was a page that list all my mentees recent edits that, maybe with some filters not sure what they should be, it would be much better if mentor can look at new edits and approve them faster. Maybe it would be even better of the edits are inline with button to approve, so it will be fast and easy for mentor to just check and approve the edits and hide edits that he checked.

Also one more feature that this page should have is thank you link on each edit.

And all this because if someone add his first edit and get it approved and visible faster, and mentor will give him personal thanks. It will increase the number of people that will keep using Wikipedia as editors. It would probably also be good idea to send notification when newcomer edit is approved, this will "force" them to open Wikipedia and see his/her edits. Those can be Preferences set by default, even on Wikipedia that don't require approval for a change to be visible (like in English Wikipedia). Notification for the newcomers that his or her edits was approved, would probably be boost of dopamine for the newcomers and he or she would like to edit more.

Another idea is that it would probably be fun to add some Gamification to newcomers, not sure how. Gamification is the topic that I'm interested and need to give more focus in 2022.

Tacsipacsi (talkcontribs)

For the FlaggedRevs notifications about accepting edits see phab:T54510.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Thank you for sharing your thoughts with us, @Jcubic!

In recent changes, you can filter down your mentees' edits: https://pl.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?mentorship=all&limit=100&days=7&title=Special:RecentChanges&urlversion=2. Then you have access yo the usual tools to validate pending edits.

Implementing Thanks in Recent changes is a Community Wishlist proposal you can vote for (if not already done).

I agree on the fact that quick validation would probably help newcomers to edit more. About thanking users, it has been proven that it helps on retention.

I'm keeping your suggestions in mind for our upcoming thinking regarding how to help mentors. Given the feedback we already received, we will focus on the Mentor dashboard first.

Regarding Gamification, it is something we have considered. We try to pursue with Add a link (available at pl.wp, have you tried it?) and with Add an image.

Jcubic (talkcontribs)
Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

It is not a bug: we have assigned a mentor to everyone for practical reasons. I understand it is confusing; you are not the first person to mention it.

We plan to work on a feature to opt-out mentoring so that experienced users won't have a mentor, I hope we can work on it soon. Edit: It is also possible to filter down your mentees on the mentor dashboard: you can set a maximum number of edits there.

Reply to "Encourage mentors to check mentees contribution + More Feedback"

Can you explore the experience of newcomers on Wikipedia?

2
Jcubic (talkcontribs)

Just a question. I have no idea how the feature work from newcomers perspective. Is there a way to see it for yourself?

Maybe some live demo or video. It would be nice to see how the experience look like to know how to improve.

Are there was any UX research done, with actual users, that was recorded?

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

The best way to test the features to create a new test account.

We have a demo video, but some details may be a but outdated.

We do UX research on all our new features. Our usual process is the following: we create a first prototype that is tested by people who aren't Wikipedia editors. When done, we refine the prototype to fix the most important points we discovered. Then we test once again with different people. The recordings are kept private per user agreement from usertesting.com, the service we use.

At this prototype stage, we usually ask experienced users at our pilot wikis to check on this prototype. We also announce prototype testings into our newsletter, so that anyone can comment on the idea. Some of Growth team members are also experienced editors in our volunteer capacity, who work with newcomers (I include myself there).

Let me know if you have any other question. :)

Reply to "Can you explore the experience of newcomers on Wikipedia?"

User research for talk page notices

4
Czar (talkcontribs)

Hi Growth Team and happy New Year! I had an idea that I wanted to plant in case you have interest or downtime. Aside from the new user dashboard features, there are many existing practices Wikipedians follow to welcome and onboard new users. If you haven't already, it would be supremely beneficial to order a round of user research on how those practices are working. I could see, for example, us finding out that blasting newcomers with a bunch of talk page templates is ultimately a waste of time for us and them if it (1) doesn't actually impart information, and (2) doesn't convert them into longer-term editors. Even something as simple as seeing how users respond to different talk page templates could give our volunteer community better insight into how our own time could be spent more effectively. (And of course there are all kinds of ways to improve our automated tools if we know the best ways to reach out to individuals.) User testing is a big blind spot for volunteers—we can template other users all day but to know what works best, we depend on pooling resources so a group like the WMF/your team can run a study for us. Happy to chat more, if useful.

Nick Moyes (talkcontribs)

A very good point.

Trizek (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hello Czar and Nick. Happy new year to you too! Thank you for stating this discussion.

While I'm not working on talk pages, I have a few things in mind, where talk pages and messages left there are studied.

Testing welcome messages at French Wikipedia, where no interaction was found regarding the messages. We actually have no idea if newcomers visit their talk page. And if they understand that they have a proper message to read there.

Only half editors read their messages (study conducted in 2012). Overall, messages are important and, when they are constructive, they can lead to more edits from newcomers.

The New Editor Experiences report has some clear findings:

  • "Many new editors could not find or use talk pages to communicate with other editors on-wiki". (page 18)
  • "New editors don’t know how to communicate with others on Wikipedia, because communications on Wikipedia are perceived to be foreign and hidden" (page 25)

During the Talk pages consultation 2019, we found that newcomers often have no idea of how to use talk pages. Which leads the Editing team to work on talk pages improvements. One of their ideas is to offer an environment where people would identify that they are on a talk page, not on a random Wikipedia content page.

I'm still unsure if newcomers understand that messages are posted at the bottom of the talk page...

Some easy improvements are at reach though (personal thinking below):

In my volunteer capacity, I also observe that a lot of volunteers (including me) unconsciously use jargon or technical terms when they interact with newcomers. Templated messages reflect this. Which could be a push back for some people who managed to find the message but don't understand what it means. Rewriting messages is a first possible step.

Also, I frequently find messages where there is no way to contact a human. At fr.wp, a small group I belong to as a volunteer decided to have some best practices regarding messages. One of them is to add a "please contact me link" to templates, to increase chances for newcomers to find a real human, and also to force users who overuse templates to take their responsibilities, by being forced to explain why they left this message. I sometimes have a few messages asking for follow up explanation now that this has been implemented; previously, I had zero follow-ups.

This being said, within WMF teams, we work to offer a cohesive user experience. So Editing and Growth work together on helping newcomers both editing and interacting with others. I let @MMiller (WMF) respond there, as he has a more cross-team vision than I have. :)

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talkcontribs)

The situation that really matters is:

  1. I edit
  2. I don't notice/read the message on my User_talk: page
  3. I edit again

The situation that doesn't matter so much is:

  1. I edit
  2. I never see any messages because I never edit again.

This should be possible to study.

Reply to "User research for talk page notices"
NGC 54 (talkcontribs)
Martin Urbanec (WMF) (talkcontribs)

Hello @NGC 54, thanks for the question! If you remove a mentor from the list of mentors, they will no longer be assigned newcomers. They will, however, retain their old mentees. While the majority of questions is asked within their first few days on the wiki, it is still possible some question will appear on the former mentor's talk page.

If you want to avoid that, we can reassign their mentees to the other mentors. To request that, just let me know here (you can also create a task in Phabricator similar to :phab:T292958).

Happy mentoring,

Reply to "Inactive mentor"
Xavier Dengra (talkcontribs)

Hi! Congrats for this tool. I have already been translating most of its interface into Catalan. To keep improving it in Catalan, may I ask you to give me permission or special access to edit Special:EditGrowthConfig in ca.wikipedia?

As you can see here, I've been managing several wikiprojects and mentorizing newcomers since years ago, so happy to test it and play with it in my language until it's a bit more mature and I can train some other wikipedians to start using it. Thank you in advance! Best regards.

Tacsipacsi (talkcontribs)

Anyone who can edit pages in the MediaWiki namespace can use Special:EditGrowthConfig—on Catalan Wikipedia, this currently means administrators and interface administrators. So you should apply for one of these rights in the way they’re handled on Catalan Wikipedia. (Or you can propose creating an interface editor group—it exists on a few wikis—, which could include only the specific right to edit the MediaWiki namespace, and not editing gadgets or blocking users.)