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Latest comment: 9 years ago by Sänger S.G in topic Filter out protected pages

Filter out protected pages[edit]

Hi! I came across this after finding some of the test accounts on English Wikipedia, then having a discussion about it on IRC. If it's at all possible, the recommendations page should filter out semi-protected pages. I think it would be very confusing for a new user to be told first "you can edit this page!" and then "No, wait, you can't!" Howicus (talk) 00:09, 12 September 2014 (UTC)Reply

@Howicus: Hey. Yes, we specifically check that the current user can edit a page before recommending it, which covers any kind of protection, including semi-protection.[1]. If you hit a bug with this, please let us know. Superm401 - Talk 03:39, 12 September 2014 (UTC)Reply
Should be extended to pages with quite a history of protection. Yesterday someone "used" this tool do vandalize in a recently often restricted article, OK the good thing is, such articles are on constant watch and so vandalism get reversed quite fast, but such contentious articles don't seem to be a decent playground for new editors. --Sänger S.G (talk) 04:25, 19 September 2014 (UTC)Reply

How To Disable "Task Recommendations"?[edit]

Is this live? Someone is asking at the EN Wikipedia Help desk how to turn it off. Perhaps someone watching this page could reply there. -- John of Reading (talk) 12:23, 12 September 2014 (UTC)Reply

(More) I think I've identified a problem: the person asking the question registered the account so long ago that it has no recorded creation date (ListUsers). Is this fooling the software into treating the account as new? -- John of Reading (talk) 12:32, 12 September 2014 (UTC)Reply

Brief Followup - I'm the person (Drbogdan) asking the question => how can I disable this "Task Recommendations" feature? (seems distracting to me at the moment) - related information about my original registration date may be noted on the following userbox code if interested => well before December 1, 2005[2] (or here => http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Help_desk/Archives/2010_October_5#What_Is_My_Registration_Date.3F ) - in any case - Enjoy! :) Drbogdan (talk) 13:16, 12 September 2014 (UTC)Reply
Yes Done - FWIW - issue has been resolved - details at => https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Help_desk#How_To_Disable_.3D.3E_After_Edit_Saved.2C_Prompt_to_Edit_.22Similar_Article.22.3F - Enjoy! :) Drbogdan (talk) 00:45, 13 September 2014 (UTC)Reply


Since there is research planned to evaluate the assumptions this is based on, why is it being implemented while those assumptions are still untested? Rich Farmbrough 19:42, 15 September 2014 (UTC).Reply

@Rich Farmbrough: I'm not really sure what you mean. Perhaps it would be clearer what our current plan is if you check out our general research page and the documentation for our first controlled test? Steven Walling (WMF) • talk 20:58, 15 September 2014 (UTC)Reply
With how many mentors and other editors, that work with new authors did you work together to develop this tool in the communities, that you tried it out? How did you plan to involve those mentors? --Sänger S.G (talk) 21:28, 15 September 2014 (UTC)Reply
@Sänger S.G: The kind of new editors we're targeting here are not the sort that already have ideas of what to do on Wikipedia, but need assistance and advice doing them. We're aiming to help those who have figured out how to make their first edit, and who are open to relevant suggestions of what to do next. Of the WMF projects that would be extremely helpful for mentors from the Mentorenprogramm to engage with, I think the most obvious one should be Flow. A large part of the theory behind Flow is that new editors have a hard time engaging with the community because the tools for discussion are hard to use. Mentors could easily help advise Foundation designers about what kind of mistakes with discussion formatting new users most typically make, so that we can craft a tool that solves those issues. Steven Walling (WMF) • talk 23:26, 15 September 2014 (UTC)Reply
You didn't answer my question: How many and which of those that deal with newbies on a daily basis did the WMF actively contact and involve in this before they started with it? It looks like something some disconnected ivory tower inhabitants developed for their own sake. Such developments without prior involvement of the community, especially in the current hostile atmosphere created by the WMF with all this shoving stuff down the throats with might against the community, is of course taken as hostile by a lot of people again, as it follows the same pattern: "We decide, bugger the editors" again.
And why should Flow, that breaks one of the possible training grounds for editing practice, the talk page, be good for new editors? A good VE, that can edit really all stuff done with wiki syntax and doesn't break any old pages, something the rubbish that was first released did, may help a bit. And of course a less hostile atmosphere towards noobs, that did really make faults because of lacking knowledge. But I really cant see why a forum system, that's seemingly unconnected to anything else in WP in regard of look and feel, could help. --Sänger S.G (talk) 04:30, 16 September 2014 (UTC)Reply
@Sänger S.G: To more succinctly answer your question: when we design a solution for new editors, we don't start by asking experienced editors if it's a good idea. People who have made hundreds or thousands of edits have a very different understanding of what the problems and gaps are when you have only made a single edit or two. Instead, we look at existing data to guide us, as a start. You can see more about this in the design documentation here, in the section "The problem". Once we have a design that we think might reasonably solve the problem at hand faced by new editors, we confirm that theory two ways:
  1. By running usability tests where we get direct feedback from people who are new to editing. This tells us whether what we've done makes a modicum of sense to the target kind of user, and is functional at the most basic level.
  2. By next running a controlled experiment, where we deliver the UI to some new editors and compare the experience to those who do not get the UI. This is underway now, and tells us objectively whether the design helps new editors contribute more productively to the encyclopedia.
The designers and developers at the Foundation are not perfectly representative of the needs of new editors, and neither are very experienced editors. When we design a new interface designed to help these people, we need to validate it using methods that get rich and reliable feedback directly from them. That's how we know whether or not it accomplishes the intended goal. Steven Walling (WMF) • talk 23:01, 18 September 2014 (UTC)Reply