VisualEditor/Feedback/Archive/2012/01

Footnotes - Where are You?
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.7 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/16.0.912.63 Safari/535.7
 * In the edit-box is a footnote "citation needed" which is not shown in the wikitext-view. But there are no footnotes in the end of the document and no way to insert them.

Where are the footnotes? An editor without footnotes makes articles without sources i.e. nonsense.

The Markup for bold and italics, headers and other styles is not so complicated and easy to learn. Difficult are footnotes, templates and tables. E.g for books it should be sufficient just to insert isbn and page number to get a complete footnote (with help of the appropriate template). 19.326.31.145 12:10, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

{ } - Templates
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.7 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/16.0.912.63 Safari/535.7

If pressing { } I would expect to get the chance to insert templates, because in Wikimarkup is used for templates tratditionally. There should be a wizard to choose the right template dependent on the categories the article is sorted in and des section which is edited:

1. Footnotes: sources 2. Top: infoboxes 3. Text: Area: sources, pictures and tables 4. Bottom: navigation bars, biographic data 29.246.31.145 12:27, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

Toolbar
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:9.0.1) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/9.0.1

I would strongly recommend you reconsider some of the labels on the toolbar if you aim to make accessible to the general public. I love what you have done so far! 205.254.147.8 17:17, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

references / citations
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.7 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/16.0.912.63 Safari/535.7

needs a button to insert references and citations 123465421jhytwretpo98721654 04:01, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

inserting images
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.7 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/16.0.912.63 Safari/535.7

needs a button to insert images 123465421jhytwretpo98721654 04:01, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

Bullet and numbered list behavior
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.11 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/17.0.963.26 Safari/535.11

In most interfaces when you want to end your bullet list you hit return twice. The first return will create an empty bullet and the second return will drop you out of bullet mode. I think it would be best to mimic that behavior in this editor too. The same should be true for numbered lists as well. 107.1.76.62 15:00, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Help expose capabilities users want but don't know how to
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.11 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/17.0.963.26 Safari/535.11

Wikipedians have created an amazing array of specialized templates to help control the visual layout of a wiki article. These are in addition to the existing MAGIC WORDS built into MediaWiki. A few examples include:, ,  , , , and. While I see that it is a requirement for the visual editor to be able to interpret and act on this code, I think it is also important for the visual editor to help users employ these tools even when they didn't know that it existed. There should be additional toolbars just like in Word, OO, Google Docs, etc that allow users to find more advanced functionality. Tools like Excel even help you find the functions you need via simple and advanced query techniques. 107.1.76.62 15:07, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Linking actions
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.11 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/17.0.963.26 Safari/535.11

There is currently only one link icon. Is it intended that this link icon will be used for both internal and external links? In my experience, inexperienced users have a great deal of difficulty conceptualizing the difference between and internal link and an external link. Anything the visual editor can do to help users not have to worry about that should be explored. Personally, I believe we should just integrate intelligence into the linking tool. Examples:

If an editor uses a full external URL to link to another wiki page, the tools should just automatically convert it to an appropriate internal link. Ideally, the tool would even be able to do this for interwiki links as well.

If an editor has highlight a word(s) to be linked, the editor should automatically try to find the correct page and prepopulate it.

I also think the editor should try to identify internal links automatically and just populate the those for the user. We know the core guidelines (only link once, link first use but not others). The tool would be generous with linking and a user should be able to just click on a link and easily remove it if the link is extraneous to the article.

In short, the visual linking tools should eliminate the need for most users from having to know the complexities of linking and just help them connect their article to other articles and information. Theflyer 15:26, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Suggestion: for newbies ON, for experienced users OFF
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (compatible; MSIE 9.0; Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; Trident/5.0; SLCC2; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; .NET CLR 3.5.30729; .NET CLR 3.0.30729; Media Center PC 6.0; InfoPath.3; .NET4.0C; .NET4.0E)


 * On cswiki Village Pump user Fagnes suggested: "Nešlo by to aspoň nastavit tak, aby to bylo u nováčků implicitně zapnuto a u ostatních explicitně vypnuto?"
 * Translated: "Is it possible to make it so that VES will be implicitly set to ON for newbie users and explicitly set to OFF for the others?
 * See: http://cs.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedie:Pod_l%C3%ADpou&diff=7890518&oldid=7890494


 * Suggested: Fagnes
 * Translated: Utar 12:28, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

Hyperlinking in fusional languages
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.7 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/16.0.912.75 Safari/535.7

I assume that there will be a similar version of hyperlinking help in VisualEditor as in the current version of the MediaWiki software. (i.e. the words in the selected like show up as you're typing). I speak a Slavic language, so I would welcome that the software would take into account the gramatical cases. For example, the hyperlinked phrase is "ruskou hokejovou reprezentací" and the name of the article is "Ruská hokejová reprezentace". As you see, only the suffixes change, and this is the case of most Indo-European languages. So it wouldn't be difficult to change the context help in the way that it would take into account only the beginnings of the words with the result that the wanted article would show up immediately. Thank you. 90.177.208.162 17:26, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

column and tables
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:9.0.1) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/9.0.1

The two features I mostly use are:


 * column to indent paragraphs at will

{ tables because I have many texts in French on the left column and English on the right column. }

Interested to know how you support them. Would it not be nice to have wysywyg on one side and wiktext on the other side and be able to enter text in both forms?

Best 89.227.88.111 15:14, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

wwwr.cbs.dk/content/view/full/382/(offset)/10?t=achieving
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3

jeg vil vidd hven han er og hvorfor.haha du er djov😊 94.144.63.215 06:16, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

Wikitext view
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:9.0.1) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/9.0.1 Iceweasel/9.0.1

This news editor is great. For backward usability (keeping the ability to edit as wikitext) that would be greater if the "Toogle wikitext view" would allow directly editing wiki syntax (and see the result in the visual editor) 193.49.225.25 16:15, 4 January 2012 (UTC)


 * First, absolutely agree that this is an awesome advance. Second, now I can't help being hungry for more, and the idea by the above contributor is right on.  Not every feature will be available in the new visual editor, and we will still need wiki markup for a while; working in markup and seeing directly the change made makes it much easier to learn markup features.  The small amount of wiki markup I've taught myself is through painful back-and-forth, "let's see what happens when we do this" self-teaching.Erudy 02:27, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Please *actively recruit* testers with disabilities
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.0; rv:9.0.1) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/9.0.1

Anytime there's a move to a Visual Anything on the web, I worry about accessibility, in particular for blind people and people disabled by pain like myself, those who find mousing painful.

Everything must be able to be done by keyboard or other methods described by the W3C Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI) or other organizations such as the American Foundation for the Blind:

http://www.afb.org/webaccess.asp

I am too sick to spend much energy here. I'm typing this up without verifying that you don't have such a team in place, which of course could be made of both disabled and currently abled (we all get disabled eventually) people.

Even if you can only recruit abled, sighted mouse-lovers, start there, as long as truly want to learn. It's a good opportunity that way, something to add to the resume about the widening of one's perception and consideration.

Lastly, Courier-type fonts worsen my migraines and occasionally can trigger them over a longer editing session. Please give us the option of editing in some other font that's distinct from that of the article, such as a serif font to contrast with the sans-serif article font.

Thanks for all your hard work. Please don't let us get lost in the scramble. And I truly wish I could be more reliable, but what lets me work on Wikipedia edits is the lack of reporting and deadlines. It's so important to me. It keeps my hand and mind just a little in the editing world I lost over 10 years ago, and with that it keeps me from feeling cut off and useless. Thanks. Geekdiva 03:34, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Toggle different views, missing features
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1) AppleWebKit/535.7 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/16.0.912.75 Safari/535.7

Toggling seems to be slow sometimes and this is puzzling. Eventually,graphical feedback about actual state would help.

What I'm missing are tables and GUI for uploading pictures 213.164.88.26 11:50, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Way to go!
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:9.0.1) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/9.0.1

This is so important for Wikipedia. Well done. Don't let the haters and nitpickers get you down. That's all! Qwerty0 16:08, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Macros for editors after they get experienced
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64) AppleWebKit/535.7 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/16.0.912.75 Safari/535.7

The most obvious missing features are images and tables and templates but I guess you know that. Looking very good though.

If you want to keep editors after they get experienced with this the thing to do is to allow them to customize. In particular letting registered editors set up and save macros would give them a strong commitment. People always value things more when they put some effort into. Dmcq 09:55, 18 January 2012 (UTC)

source-editing
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:12.0a1) Gecko/20120119 Firefox/12.0a1

the editor needs definitely a source-editing-mode, e.g. for tables. Dänenleo 16:16, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Sketchy toolbar
Toolbar is so incomplete, there are no Insert image, make a table, refrences, templat, etc... Fabi Fuu 76 00:10, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Sorry, but there are many bugfixes needed.
User agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 8.0; Windows NT 5.1; Trident/4.0; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; .NET CLR 3.0.04506.30; .NET CLR 3.0.04506.648; .NET CLR 3.0.4506.2152; .NET CLR 3.5.30729; .NET4.0C; .NET4.0E)

I tested today the new Visual editor, and I saw that there are many bugs. If you click to make a link, then you see that the window is hyaline. Another problem is that you cannot delete a link totally. That are two major problems that need to be solved. 194.31.121.12 11:55, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

Upload images and assign categories?
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:9.0.1) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/9.0.1

I really like where this is going, but is their a plan to add those features in the future? 140.190.67.217 17:16, 31 January 2012 (UTC)

Direct editing without heavy editors
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:10.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/10.0

Great intuitive work with imminent interaction to the written word. Great time-saver. 217.157.144.138 22:29, 31 January 2012 (UTC)