Skin talk:Timeless/Archive 1

Broken TOC (Table of Contents): No indentation -- SOLVED
Does anyone know how to fix this? https://i.imgur.com/0eUDx0m.png I can't figure out why this is happening. It's a completely fresh install of MediaWiki 1.31.1 using the bundled Timeless skin. Drirton (talk) 23:49, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
 * So as it would turn out, it was an easy fix. I was using the bundled version of the skin that came with MediaWiki 1.31.1. So I deleted it from my  directory and installed the latest development version (master), reloaded the page, and it worked perfectly. Hopefully this helps anyone else who runs into this problem. Anywho- thanks for fixing that in the latest version. It's a beautiful skin. That was just a really big problem for me. Drirton (talk) 00:05, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Thanx U
Thanx U very much for your skin ;) Anonimous user 10:56, 17 Feb 2017 (UTC+3)

Thanks for this skin, Isarra. It's beautiful! NiharikaKohli (talk) 02:11, 23 January 2016 (UTC)


 * <3 -— Isarra ༆ 23:26, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Purge page tab not working
I love the skin. It is beautiful, and I love that it is responsive. But I am trying to either install the Purge extension or the Purge gadget, which is supposed to add a menu or tab item to easily purge a page. Both the extension and the gadget work fine in the vector skin, but they do not work in the timeless skin. It seems that the Timeless skin is not recognizing the Hooks/SkinTemplateNavigation. Are there any plans to fix this?

Zzmonty (talk) 06:31, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Visual Editor support
Hi, thanks for the best skin for mediawiki. But i have question, can it be edited to work with visual editor?

Well i made progress here: https://github.com/ElNovi/mediawiki-skins-Timeless
 * This actually resulted in it being supported in general! -— Isarra ༆ 00:16, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Formatting on search page.
I don't know if anyone else will come across this, but I was getting some weird formatting on the search page.



I was however able to get this fixed (at least for now) by editing /w/resources/src/mediawiki.special/mediawiki.special.search.css.

Specifically this; .mw-search-results { margin-left: 0.4em; float: left; }

Changed to; .mw-search-results { margin-left: 0.4em; float: center; }

Now it displays like this:



Just putting this here in case anyone else comes across this issue.

Y'all should sign your posts.
Also, like, thanks and stuff. I've filed bugs for all of the mentioned bugs. Sorry I didn't see this sooner; I kind of abandoned the entire thing for awhile there. -— Isarra ༆ 05:12, 7 April 2016 (UTC)


 * You could turn on Flow for this page. Then all the things are signed. :) Sam Wilson 00:10, 28 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Oh, let's! Then I could just ignore everyone completely! -— Isarra ༆ 20:16, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Hover menus
Speaking of something I noticed when trying it out here: https://simple.wikipedia.beta.wmflabs.org/wiki/Baseball_uniform?useskin=timeless

Hover menus like that require skilled mouse pointing/usage, which can prove difficult for people with hand mobility issues or who don't fully master mouse usage yet (eg. young children, people who are new to computers, etc.). Since the hover areas aren't links themselves, you could mitigate that problem by making hover menus stick open if one clicks on the area that triggers the hover menu at the moment. Subsequently trying to click on the links the menu contains, with the menu stuck open, becomes less difficult because accidentally hovering outside no longer closes the menu.

There are probably other solutions, but as it stands, this kind of hover menu can create frustration for people who already have a frustrating web browsing experience where clicking on a link that doesn't move is already a challenge, let alone one that is conditionally visible.

Also, I don't know how well that hover menu would interact with screen readers, that probably needs testing.

--GDubuc (WMF) (talk) 08:26, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Filed: T211357. -— Isarra ༆ 17:35, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Feedback
This skin has got several features I have been thinking about for years. Well done, ! However, there are a few improvements I would humbly like to suggest: Anyway, congratulations for your work so far!--Erasmo Barresi (talk) 23:19, 16 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Looking at a page like this, one sees too many colors. The colors of the links and images are inevitable. Nor do I mind the colored horizontal line under the search box (although one color might be better than three, I don't know), but the red and the blue under the headings are definitely superfluous.
 * Headings of different levels are too similar in size.
 * I think that "site functions" and "page functions" should be appropriately differentiated. They are not differentiated in the current Vector skin, but this could be a major area of improvement. It would not be bad, for example, to have all "site functions" in the left sidebar and all "page functions" on the right. You could try moving "Print/export", as well as all the "Wiki tools" except "Upload file" and "Special pages", to the right; the result may be interesting.

I see on your userpage that you are also creating less "serious" skins, which better suit certain kinds of non-Wikimedia projects. The suggestions I give above, especially the one about the colors, are specifically intended for the kind of work we do here at Wikimedia projects. So they may or may not interest you, depending on the scope you want your skin to have.--Erasmo Barresi (talk) 23:26, 16 May 2017 (UTC)
 * The colours problem has been partially addressed, but I've left T182388 open regardless, as it's still perhaps a bit much. Also apparently filed T207608 later as a partial duplicate, but that might be more about the internal specification of the colours.
 * Heading sizes/distinction has been a running issue for a long time, not just in Timeless. Filed T211360 for general case here, though, and some specific examples are also on phabricator.
 * Doesn't Timeless already do this? That's like half the skin's internal horribleness just to do that. And as I recall someone killed most of the other half to get hotcat working...
 * -— Isarra ༆ 17:47, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * #3 I'm looking at an article on the English Wikipedia: "Print/export" and "In other projects", which concern the page, are placed alongside "Navigation" and "Interaction", which concern the site; just below these, "Cite this page" and "Get shortened URL", which concern the page, are placed alongside "Upload file" and "Special pages", which concern the site. But maybe you have no control over this… Does it all depend on how the individual wikis are manually set up?--Erasmo Barresi (talk) 21:52, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
 * #3 I'm looking at an article on the English Wikipedia: "Print/export" and "In other projects", which concern the page, are placed alongside "Navigation" and "Interaction", which concern the site; just below these, "Cite this page" and "Get shortened URL", which concern the page, are placed alongside "Upload file" and "Special pages", which concern the site. But maybe you have no control over this… Does it all depend on how the individual wikis are manually set up?--Erasmo Barresi (talk) 21:52, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Compatibility
Seems to work with MW 1.27.3 other experiences?RichardHeigl (talk) 14:08, 19 July 2017 (UTC)
 * I'm using it in 1.29 and it works well, as far as I can tell Txantimedia (talk) 22:29, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Timeless seems to work fine on 1.30, as far as I can tell Noloader (talk) 04:08, 24 December 2017 (UTC)

Font needs improvement
Somehow the font used by this skin is bad. After a couple of minutes I get a headache probably since it is pretty blurry and small. I think it will be better to use the same font as for the Vector skin. I am using the skin an a regular PC with 1920 x 1080. Cheers --&#91;&#91;kgh&#93;&#93; (talk) 22:35, 4 September 2017 (UTC)


 * @kgh - At the risk of sounding argumentative, I think the font selection is fine. I have older eyes, and I configure the browser with 110% Zoom for all pages. Maybe that speaks to the need for a $wgTimelessFontScale setting. Noloader (talk) 04:35, 24 December 2017 (UTC)


 * Well, I think it's bad too, but whether or not it's apt to be an issue is a bit of a platform-specific thing. I just haven't gotten around to killing it. -— Isarra ༆ 22:28, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Grant proposal: Post-deployment support for Timeless and stuff
Note, I've submitted a grant proposal on meta to better address all the work needed on Timeless.

Also, separate note, I do appreciate all the issues/questions people are bringing up here and do plan to properly address them as well when I can. I'm not just ignoring you, I swear. -— Isarra ༆ 19:50, 17 October 2017 (UTC)


 * Good luck with the proposal and grant. It would be nice to see you compensated for your time. Its one thing when a small number of users need support and you can do it in your spare time. It's a different situation when the skin is adopted system-wide and support demands increase 5 fold. Noloader (talk) 04:11, 24 December 2017 (UTC)


 * To be fair, wide adoption does mean it can be much more quickly debugged and such, so there is that. Generally speaking the issues would be there whether there's ten users or several hundred. -— Isarra ༆ 22:27, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Can I help?
I love the Timeless skin. It's way better than the defaults. If I can help track down bugs, I'm willing to do so. I'm not a programmer, but I can read and understand code somewhat, and I can track things down pretty well. One thing I'm having trouble with is a custom button in WikiEditor appears randomly. Sometimes it's there when you open edit. Sometimes I have to reload the page repeatedly before it shows up. I don't think this is a problem related to the Timeless skin, but perhaps it is. Txantimedia (talk) 22:29, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Can you test and see if this issue occurs in other skins? -— Isarra ༆ 20:06, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

wikisource feedback

 * s:Wikisource:Scriptorium. Slowking4 (talk) 01:04, 26 November 2017 (UTC)


 * Archived to s:Wikisource:Scriptorium/Archives/2017-12

For more inline reference:
 * 1) Index: namespace— drop down list field for "type" is too wide for central pane
 * 2) both right and left menus, the opposite of "minerva", loads fast - top "your account" drop down box - hides some left menu, would rather move it all there. "more" menu on right is a waste of real estate. waste of space on top toolbar for a large search box
 * apparently works better on wikipedia, with four dropdown menus: navigation; wiki tools; page tools; languages. with a fifth user menu with search box. maybe they should check out why it does not work the same for wikisource?
 * 1) font-size is too big which is causing wrapping in prev/next, and in pop-up forms.

1. appears to have since been fixed; 2. seems to cover various issues with the nav layout... UX ain't great, but we'll see if some of the other rijigs help with this (improved header, user preferences for how to handle the site nav). 3. is... a problem, yes.

I know it's been a stupidly long time, but can you link to specific examples for any of these? -— Isarra ༆ 21:50, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * User:Isarra - sorry about the the delay.
 * . Index seems to be working well.
 * . did not realize that the menus dynamically shift to top drop down at higher zoom level. this is a nice feature for small screens. (maybe some user orientation would be good)
 * . i see "previous page" ; "next page" buttons work well (other skins use "<" ; ">" alternate solution for font size problem)
 * here are some screenshots showing zoom level, to make left menu collapse. File:Timeless skin half zoomed in.jpg; File:Timeless skin zoomed in.jpg - i will be using this going forward, it allows more zoom on a small screen, by grabbing real estate from left hand menu. and give a VE-like appearance, but with better wikisource menu options (VE has a wikipedia focus of menu choices, which renders it less useful) don't know what adoption will be among the grumpy old men, but i will try demonstrating with newbies. Slowking4 (talk) 02:58, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

Wierd link
Hello, Isarra. I am on Special:Watchlist now. The manu "page tools" has a button "special page", connected to itself. Why do you need it? Thank you. IKhitron (talk) 10:08, 27 November 2017 (UTC)
 * It's the page self-link (the page tab in others) often used to reload the page/whatever. That's probably not the best place for it on mobile special pages, though... if it even makes sense to keep it at all at that point. -— Isarra ༆ 22:25, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

Nice
Nice skin! Works great on es.wiki. -- Mia o w   00:02, 28 November 2017 (UTC)

Not quite…
It looks nice, but after a while I start to notice a kind of error. There are simply to many layers at the top in the half-compact view. You have site (with search and personal), site navigation, page, and page navigation. Four levels? Add that some pages at Wikipedia has their own levels. This is simply way to much!

Add site navigation as icons at the site level, and likewise add page navigation as icons at the page level. That would shrink the top to two levels, and make it more manageable.

In the very-compact view there are icons for this, but the line for page navigation is still there. That leaves three levels, which is one too many.

My gut feeling is that this skin needs further cleansing of unneeded stuff, it tries to keep to many elements visible. What we sell is content, not navigation. Now it has become way to much navigation. Jeblad (talk) 07:43, 28 November 2017 (UTC)

en.wiki
Beautiful skin but I can't see Twinkle options when I'am on a user talk page to warn them when their edits are unconstructive. -- Mia o w   17:08, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Was marked and fixed as an issue in Twinkle specifically (T181206 was filed and closed for Timeless), but underlying problems with dom inconsistency between skins/lack of standard apis remains... -— Isarra ༆ 23:21, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

nl.wiki
On the Dutch Wikipedia, clicking "+" to add a new section or topic doesn't do anything. This button does work on the English Wikipedia and here on MediaWiki. Woodcutterty (talk) 18:52, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Works for me on nl:Overleg:Hoofdpagina. IKhitron (talk) 19:15, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Doesn't do anything for me: . Woodcutterty (talk) 21:23, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
 * I hope this fixed itself, because it's downright peculiar. (Also can't replicate, a year later.) -— Isarra ༆ 23:21, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Resume editing
I use the 2017 wikitext editor, and I noticed that after clicking "Show preview" the "Resume editing" button in the top left corner is missing. So I have to return to the save form first and resume editing from there. Woodcutterty (talk) 10:28, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Appears resolved now. -— Isarra ༆ 23:34, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Removing the right and left sides
Hello, Is there any way that we can remove the right and the left sides of the body ? I mean to remove the logo and all menus from the left and right side in order to use the whole wide for the body of the page ? Adrianevs (talk) 20:30, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Very stupid answer: make you browser window a little narrower. IKhitron (talk) 18:44, 30 November 2017 (UTC)

Remove wiki logo through LocalSettings.php


Isarra, thank you very much for the Timeless skin. I think it is one of the best MediaWiki offers.

I would like to use Timeless as our default skin, but I would like one change. I would like to disable the logo on our wiki, and I would like the menu's on the left shifted up to take its place. The menu's on the left are Navigation and Wiki Tools. I think our logo looks bad on this particular skin (though it looks good with MonoSpace, Vector, and other skins).

A second request is, I would like to set "no logo" through LocalSettings.php. That's because our skins (and extensions) are clones of the repo's that provide them. Each night a cron job runs that does a git reset --hard HEAD && git pull in the local repo. The script resets any changes and updates the skin to the latest source (you can see the script here). Because the daily update would discard a local change we like to persist the change through LocalSettings.php.

As [I believe] the image on the right shows, our logo detracts from the skin's handsomeness.

Noloader (talk) 03:53, 24 December 2017 (UTC)
 * You should be able to remove it using the onwiki MediaWiki:Timeless.css - add the following there and it'll disappear. -— Isarra ༆ 22:34, 1 May 2018 (UTC)

FastCCI on Commons
One issue in Wikimedia Commons, when you are in a category and you want to open the menu of the tool FastCCI then it is opened in background and the menu is hidden. --Christian Ferrer (talk) 00:10, 25 December 2017 (UTC)
 * + Also the "page tools" section on the File pages don't include all the option selected in the "preferences", example such as the Image search gadgets or any similar gadgets that you can write yourself in your common.js. --Christian Ferrer (talk) 00:57, 25 December 2017 (UTC)


 * FastCCI seems fine now, but the other gadgets could be various issues even now. I should probably have surveyed various projects back when first deployed to figure out what all the likely problems are going to be with any new skin, but perhaps this can still go somewhere... -— Isarra ༆ 00:24, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Indenting on Legend list
I'm using Firefox 57.0.2 on Windows. It looks like the indenting for the legend is off a bit: https://imgur.com/a/wltk5.

Sorry I did not post to mediawiki. The buttons for file upload are hidden in the Timeless skin, so I cannot operate the File Select dialog box. Hint: I am using a laptop, not a tablet in portrait mode. You don't have the screen real-estate you expect.

19:06, 26 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Cripes, this still hasn't been fixed. -— Isarra ༆ 00:27, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Issues with very small screens
On small screens (in particular smartphones) there appear a few issues with overlapping content etc wich makes it difficult to use there. I’ve added a bit css, so this does not concern me on wmf-wikis:

regards –KPFC (talk) 18:19, 28 January 2018 (UTC) [edited –KPFC (talk) 15:06, 1 May 2018 (UTC)]

Heading anchors
When I click a link from an article TOC to a heading I expect it to be visible but it is covered by the 'mediawiki search 35,036 pages ' pane instead. See included screencast. Is there a workaround? --Gryllida 22:56, 18 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Should now (or whenever it's actually deployed) be fixed (again, but properly this time). -— Isarra ༆ 00:46, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Aha! Thank you! I have put Timeless-master-0b821b4 into the development version of my wiki. Anchors are working better now than in the MW1.31.1 Timeless version. However, each page Table of Contents link still overshoots its anchor targets every time after the first time it is clicked. One time use? Hmm. If I do a page reload each page Table of Contents item works again the first time I click it, but overshoots it's target thereafter, till I reload the page again. So something is not quite right there I think. Hope this helps! BTW, my favorite feature of Timeless is the way the page layout automatically modifies to suit small screens like smartphones. Well done! :) --Rogerhc (talk) 05:27, 7 January 2019 (UTC)

Highlighting issue
Now that's pretty odd, but I have a highlighting problem in Chrome (also Opera and Maxthon, but not IE!). When I try to select some symbols to copy with my mouse, it just selects three or four symbols and then stops doing that. I move the cursor, but nothing happens - four symbols selected, that's all. Then if I move mouse far away - to the other line, for example, plenty of symbols suddenly get selected, but then it freezes again. I've figured this happens only with this skin applied. Also I've noticed, that this happens only to those pages which are short and don't have a scrollbar. This is extremeley wierd, but that's how it works. Also I've noticed, that if I narrow my browser window so that scrollbar appears, highlighting starts to work.

15:24, 3 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Sounds like T183215 and related - chrome is a piece of crap and just does not like certain overflow rules, it seems... it's a high priority, though. -— Isarra ༆ 20:15, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

How to display the title of the link called from the summary?
When I click on a link of summary, I arrive at the content, but, the title, it is at the top, I have to use the ascenceur of the navigator to go up and to be able to see the title.

Need help, i want display the title of the link called from the summary.

After a few tests, I notice that it is the banner in fixed position which covers the title called since the anchor of the summary, but, I can not modify the CSS so that the call of a link since the summary can display the title, below the fixed search banner.


 * Was T181484. Fixed. -— Isarra ༆ 00:49, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Thankfulness
I'd simply like to express my gratitude for that beautiful skin. --Cherämon (talk) 10:47, 4 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you! -— Isarra ༆ 00:50, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Title breaks
Hello, I have a problem with the title (site name) in the top-left corner breaking over two decks in Firefox and IE11. It stays on a single line in Chrome.

The title is two words, 12 characters (including the space) and should fit on a single line.

Is there a css solution to this?
 * Make it... smaller, perhaps. Sounds like chrome is doing the fonts differently, or something. -— Isarra ༆ 00:57, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

How do I hide the sidebar with Timeless skin?
Hello, I have tried to edit Mediawiki:common.css to hide my sidebar with use Timeless skin. It works for my Chameleon skin, but when I switch to Timeless, it doesn't work?

Is it possable to hide sidebar when use timeless skin? I want my contant have full wide screen, and also want to replace a dropdown menu to the site logo place.

FirehorseMG (talk)
 * Would having T131803 available plus some CSS to make the skin full-width do what you want? -— Isarra ༆ 00:56, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Disable View source and History for non-logged in users
Hi, how can I do that? I guess in that case I also want to hide the "View" button (again for non-logged in users only) as it will be the only possibility. Many thanks :)--Spiros71 (talk) 10:18, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Simplest way I can think of would be to put some js in your MediaWiki:Timeless.js to check if user is logged in, and if not, hide/remove the elements. There might be better, though. -— Isarra ༆ 02:38, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Injecting content below page tools
Thank you for the previous reply and the beautiful skin :) I wonder where exactly I can add some dynamic content on the template so that it appears below the page tools level (View-Edit-History).--Spiros71 (talk) 08:40, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

Hello.
This skin is quality. But there is something bothering me: the cat. Can you give me a code for Timeless.css to hide the cat? Thanks --122.106.254.105 23:55, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

Not Valid W3C HTML
In TimelessTemplate.php class "pokey" in tag, this is not valid! Аlso a problem not directly related to this skin In /includes/skins/SkinTemplate.php "$content_navigation['views']['view']['redundant'] = true;" add not valid parameter in tag  "redundant" if set "false" and comment class "pokey", code in THML is a clean! if comment these valuess of the code will cause my site to malfunction? In footer links it's nice to have a different color from the normal text. screen-common.less example: add this in: #mw-footer /* My style links */ a { text-decoration: none; color: #FF7F50;
 * 1) mw-footer {

&:hover, &:visited { color: #FF7F50; }      	}

--Ncode-iv (talk) 07:52, 26 December 2018 (UTC)